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The Dice Tower» Forums » General

Subject: It appears that Vasel's law has proved true once again rss

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Ian Gent
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Vasel's law strikes again, BGG reporting on twitter that Thames and Kosmos will reprint The Pillars of the Earth.

https://twitter.com/BoardGameGeek/status/819205561417875456
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Ryan Keane
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Ha ha, so every time a game gets reprinted, it proves the Law? C'mon, it's a meaningless, circular argument that can't be proved or disproved.

If a game gets reprinted, it's great. If a game doesn't get reprinted, it's not great. Hence, every great game will get reprinted.
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Guillaume Courtemanche
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Zee mentionned he'd like to see a reprint of Pillars I think.

That's good news.. as always.
 
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Cynthia
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Fantastic!!
 
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Bill Grant
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Even if the law can't be proved or disproved I think it's healthy advice for all of us with acquisition disorder, or FOMO (fear of missing out).

If one buys every game that they like, with the fear that someday it may go out of print and will never be available again, then one will put unnecessary strain on one's bank account and home space.

If instead one assumes any good game with wide appeal will remain in print or will be re-printed, then one doesn't need to worry about getting games they don't need just to avoid the potential loss.

Easier said then done, but good none the less. I'd love to have a copy of Glory to Rome but I've got plenty of other games to keep me busy that it's not the end of the world.
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Olli Juhala
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Ryan Keane wrote:
Ha ha, so every time a game gets reprinted, it proves the Law? C'mon, it's a meaningless, circular argument that can't be proved or disproved.

If a game gets reprinted, it's great. If a game doesn't get reprinted, it's not great. Hence, every great game will get reprinted.


Methinks you are taking this Law thing a bit too seriously.
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Bryant Hudson
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Maybe your army comes and maybe it’s too much for us, but it’s all on you. Because if we can’t protect the Earth, you can be damn well sure we’ll avenge it.
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Shader10 wrote:
Ryan Keane wrote:
Ha ha, so every time a game gets reprinted, it proves the Law? C'mon, it's a meaningless, circular argument that can't be proved or disproved.

If a game gets reprinted, it's great. If a game doesn't get reprinted, it's not great. Hence, every great game will get reprinted.


Methinks you are taking this Law thing a bit too seriously.


Agreed.
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Ryan Keane
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Shader10 wrote:
Ryan Keane wrote:
Ha ha, so every time a game gets reprinted, it proves the Law? C'mon, it's a meaningless, circular argument that can't be proved or disproved.

If a game gets reprinted, it's great. If a game doesn't get reprinted, it's not great. Hence, every great game will get reprinted.


Methinks you are taking this Law thing a bit too seriously.


No, I'm laughing about it.
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Mike
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datajack wrote:
Zee mentionned he'd like to see a reprint of Pillars I think.

That's good news.. as always.


So really it is more like Vasel and Zee's Law.
 
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mortego
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Hahahahahaha, well, I know who Vasel is but I have no idea who his "haters" are...so, he wins.


Vasel's Law stands as proven.
 
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Joe Kundlak
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Woohoo!
I wonder if we get a local reprint (as we had a Czech version before, now OOP), but even if not, this is wonderful news! I traded this game (sadly) a few years ago, so might get it again!
 
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Bryan Thunkd
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Shader10 wrote:
Ryan Keane wrote:
Ha ha, so every time a game gets reprinted, it proves the Law? C'mon, it's a meaningless, circular argument that can't be proved or disproved.

If a game gets reprinted, it's great. If a game doesn't get reprinted, it's not great. Hence, every great game will get reprinted.


Methinks you are taking this Law thing a bit too seriously.
Not if people are going to quote it as a "law". If people get to go around pretending it means something, then we get to point out that it really doesn't.
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Bryan Thunkd
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killerjoe1962 wrote:
Vasel's Law stands as proven.
Except that for any game without a reprint, if I convince you that it will never be reprinted, you'll tell me it's not a great game. And any game that I convince you is great, you'll tell me that it will eventually get a reprint.

Without a time machine or checking back in a twenty years, there's no way we can establish that a game won't get a reprint.

But while Pillars of the Earth might seem to be confirmation of Vasel's Law, it's actually a condemnation of it. Sure PotE got a reprint. But Vasel's Law is meant to curb your fear of missing out on a game, reassuring you that if it's really worth getting, it will be reprinted. But what this reprint really tells us is that if you were afraid of missing out on Pillars of the Earth when it came out, you probably should have bought it, because it didn't get a reprint for 10 years.

Personally, I think it's okay to miss out on some games. It doesn't make your life any worse to not play Game X. And usually Game X isn't as great as people make it out to be. I suspect that some of the people who have been waiting a long time to Play PotE will be disappointed when they finally get to play it. It's a good game, but not one worth waiting ten years for.

So I guess we can restate Vasel's Law... don't worry about missing out a great game... if it's really great, it'll get reprinted in a decade or two. Just wait ten, fifteen or twenty years and you'll be able to get it again.
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Bill Grant
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Does anyone actually think that a Boardgaming "law" is supposed to stand up to the same standards as a scientific law does?

Just realized I answered my own question. Boardgamers think this. They are checking the rulebook as we speak.

I won't speak for Tom but I'm pretty sure he is not holding his law up to gravity. (Which I think was superceded by a theory...)
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Bryan Thunkd
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Billgrant wrote:
Does anyone actually think that a Boardgaming "law" is supposed to stand up to the same standards as a scientific law does?
No. But I also don't think that we should hold up meaningless tautologies as boardgaming laws. "Great games get reprinted, a game which doesn't get reprinted isn't great" is devoid of any useful content.

If you try to go beyond the tautology, and find the purpose of the law, it's "don't worry about missing games, they'll come around again or they weren't worth it in the first place". But given that few people are willing to forgo buying a game because they'll be able to pick it up again in 10 years, this "law" isn't even a good law to follow.
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Kenny Johnson
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Thunkd wrote:
Billgrant wrote:
Does anyone actually think that a Boardgaming "law" is supposed to stand up to the same standards as a scientific law does?
No. But I also don't think that we should hold up meaningless tautologies as boardgaming laws. "Great games get reprinted, a game which doesn't get reprinted isn't great" is devoid of any useful content.

If you try to go beyond the tautology, and find the purpose of the law, it's "don't worry about missing games, they'll come around again or they weren't worth it in the first place". But given that few people are willing to forgo buying a game because they'll be able to pick it up again in 10 years, this "law" isn't even a good law to follow.


So the answer is yes... taking it too seriously.

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Ryan Keane
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Thunkd wrote:

Personally, I think it's okay to miss out on some games. It doesn't make your life any worse to not play Game X. And usually Game X isn't as great as people make it out to be. I suspect that some of the people who have been waiting a long time to Play PotE will be disappointed when they finally get to play it. It's a good game, but not one worth waiting ten years for.


I was joking in my first post - I don't really care about Tom's Law. What I care about is criticism of people seeking out OOP games or soon-to-be OOP games, which is the topic that Tom was addressing in his original video rant. If you have researched a game and it looks like a perfect match for your tastes, or even better you've played someone else's copy and love it, then it very much might be worth it to you to seek out purchasing that game, even if it's double or triple the price of some new game (and especially a Kickstarted game that hasn't even been played and honestly evaluated by a significant number of people). Honestly, anyone who pledged for Kingdom Death Monster has lost any right to ever criticize someone for paying a lot for an OOP game.

For my #1 game, it was OOP when I discovered it, I researched it, it looked like a great match and I got a copy from the BGG marketplace for a pretty reasonable price. I have corresponded with the designer about a new version and playtested it, but I don't expect it to get reprinted any time soon. My wife and I have had endless hours of enjoyment from that purchase, and I know of no new game that's come out since that would have equaled it.

New games are not always better, and life is too short to wait for an OOP game you want to be reprinted.
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Christian K
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I don't think the purpose is to criticize anyone. I think he was just trying to make people not worry and be happy

If someone is happy buying oop games for a high price, I don't think Tom (or anyone else) has a problem with that

Btw, I agree that the law is terrible
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John John
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If this thread continues with such a degradation of ad hominem attacks and concrete inability to have a sense of humour, and especially an inability to tolerate other's points of view, I may be forced to taunt Godwin's Law.
 
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mortego
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Wow! What an amazing retort.....just, wow...



let it go....

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Runcible Spoon
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Thunkd wrote:
Billgrant wrote:
Does anyone actually think that a Boardgaming "law" is supposed to stand up to the same standards as a scientific law does?
No. But I also don't think that we should hold up meaningless tautologies as boardgaming laws. "Great games get reprinted, a game which doesn't get reprinted isn't great" is devoid of any useful content.


Exactly.

Vasel's Law is a fine example of a logical fallacy. When quoted it is an obvious representation of bad reasoning.

I think as a community we would be better off letting this meme die out.
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mortego
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so, "no fun" or void of having "fun" is the now a law?

yeah, it doesn't work that way.
 
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Wayne Walker
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Billgrant wrote:
Even if the law can't be proved or disproved I think it's healthy advice for all of us with acquisition disorder, or FOMO (fear of missing out).

If one buys every game that they like, with the fear that someday it may go out of print and will never be available again, then one will put unnecessary strain on one's bank account and home space.

If instead one assumes any good game with wide appeal will remain in print or will be re-printed, then one doesn't need to worry about getting games they don't need just to avoid the potential loss.

Easier said then done, but good none the less. I'd love to have a copy of Glory to Rome but I've got plenty of other games to keep me busy that it's not the end of the world.


Just dripping with wisdom. Well said sir!

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Jonathan Powell
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Shader10 wrote:
Methinks


Please start every one of your BGG posts this way.
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Perry Clayton
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Wow! The Pillars of the Earth is being reprinted!

That's terrific!
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